Author Topic: Reinstating the Draft  (Read 4083 times)

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Offline Deborah

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Reinstating the Draft
« on: October 03, 2004, 05:51:00 PM »
http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/01/07/rangel.draft/

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Rep. Charles Rangel introduced a bill in Congress Tuesday to reinstate the military draft, saying fighting forces should more closely reflect the economic makeup of the nation.

"I truly believe that those who make the decision and those who support the United States going into war would feel more readily the pain that's involved, the sacrifice that's involved, if they thought that the fighting force would include the affluent and those who historically have avoided this great responsibility," Rangel said.

"Those who love this country have a patriotic obligation to defend this country," Rangel said. "For those who say the poor fight better, I say give the rich a chance."
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Offline Mister Pink

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Reinstating the Draft
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2004, 02:46:00 PM »
good for Mr. Rangel, lucky for us all tho, that the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES just declared the United States military "will remain an all-volunteer fighting force". I don't see some dinky congressman getting all too much support for that draft either.
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Offline Anonymous

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Reinstating the Draft
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2004, 04:08:00 PM »
Those comments were made in 2003, but I like what he had to say. The draft might be inevitable if too many begin to see the light and stop volunteering. Dean's take on it:

Howard Dean | Hidden Agenda: A National Draft in the Future?
Author: Howard Dean
Published on Sep 20, 2004, 07:08

A key issue for young Americans and their families to consider as they prepare to cast their votes in the upcoming presidential election is the real likelihood of a military draft being reinstated if President Bush is re-elected. President Bush should tell us now whether he supports a military draft.

Here is the evidence that makes a draft likely:

The U.S. Army has acknowledged that they are stretched thin and that finding new recruits is challenging. They recently placed 300 new
recruiters in the field. Bonuses for new recruits to the Army have risen by 67 percent to a maximum of $10,000 and $15,000 for hard-to-fill
specialties.

The extended tours of duty have made service less attractive for both the regular armed forces, and particularly for the National Guard and Reserves. To meet this year's quota for enlistees, the Army has sped up the induction of "delayed entry" recruits, meaning they are already borrowing from next year's quotas in order to meet this year's numbers.

Reservists are now being called away for longer periods. In 2003, President Bush dramatically extended the length of time for the Guard and
Reserves deployment in Iraq. Extended tours of up to a year have become common.

In a further sign of a lack of adequate staffing, the armed forces are now in the process of calling up members of the Individual Ready Reserves. These are often older reservists usually waiting retirement. They are typically in their mid-to-late forties, and have not been on active duty and have not trained for some time. Traditionally, they are only supposed to be called up during a time of national emergency. In 2001, President Bush authorized their call up but never rescinded this order even after he declared "Mission Accomplished" in Iraq in May of 2003.

The Armed Forces are already chronically understaffed. In 2003, General Eric Shinseki testified before Congress that an additional 50,000 troops would be needed beyond what the Bush administration said would be necessary to stabilize Iraq after the invasion. The President ignored him. We do not have enough troops in Afghanistan to be able to stabilize the country, as shown by the continual putting off of elections well past their announced date. In an effort to free up yet more troops in the coming years, we are moving troops away from the Demilitarized Zone in Korea and reducing the number of troops on the Korean Peninsula at a time
when North Korea poses more of a danger to the U.S. - not less. Because of the President's military adventurism, our Armed Forces are under enormous pressure. The only place to go for more troops is a draft.

Selective service boards have already been notified that 20-year-olds and medical personnel will be called up first.

President Bush will be forced to decide whether we can continue the current course in Iraq, which will clearly require the reinstatement of the draft. The Pentagon has objected to a draft but, the President has ignored other Pentagon recommendations in the past.

American families and young people are owed an explanation about the President's plans. Will the President withdraw from some of our military
commitments or will he reinstate the draft? We need to know that before we vote, not afterwards.

Howard Dean, former governor of Vermont, is the founder of Democracy for America, a grassroots organization that supports socially progressive and fiscally responsible political candidates. Email Howard Dean at howarddean@democracyforamerica.com
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Offline thepatriot

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Reinstating the Draft
« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2004, 12:53:00 PM »
2 voted to reinstate, 2 Dems and Rengal voted against. What a buch of morons we have on the hill, to even put it to a vote was a waste of time. The sad thing about it is, some are still trying to convince college kids its going to happen, gotta love the spin
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Offline Antigen

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Reinstating the Draft
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2004, 01:01:00 PM »
Well, we're running out of reserve and national guard to ship over there. New volunteer recruits are way down. So either we're going to withdraw troops from somewhere or we're going to have to generate involuntary troops.

Which do you think will happen, regardless of which way the next election goes?

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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2004, 01:16:00 PM »
No Child Left Behind By Military Recruiters
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... forum=32&1
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Offline thepatriot

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Reinstating the Draft
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2004, 01:17:00 PM »
I don't really know, it could go either way. If things don't change. No matter who is elected I really don't think it will happen, I am definately opposed to it ,a volunteer military works much better  than the draft. The only manditory military time I think should be required by anybody running for president or Senate and I believe it should be a 3 year active term minimun to qualify to run. Pretty dam sad when the bumb in office or the idiot trying to oust him have very little military experiance. I just think its sad we have people setting policy on our military on the hill that have no clue as to how it is run and the realities of running it.

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[ This Message was edited by: thepatriot on 2004-10-08 10:18 ]
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Offline thepatriot

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« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2004, 01:20:00 PM »
Quote
On 2004-10-08 10:16:00, Anonymous wrote:

"No Child Left Behind By Military Recruiters

http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... forum=32&1"


They have already been doing that shit a long time, that is old news, I worked 90 days in a recruiting office....no new story there. Other than somebody finding something else to cry conspiracy about.

"Leah C. Wells serves as the Peace Education Coordinator for the Nuclear Age Peace Foundation."

that says it all give me a fucking break
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[ This Message was edited by: thepatriot on 2004-10-08 10:36 ][ This Message was edited by: thepatriot on 2004-10-08 10:38 ][ This Message was edited by: thepatriot on 2004-10-08 10:38 ]
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Offline Tony Stark

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Reinstating the Draft
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2004, 02:30:00 AM »
Maybe they wouldn't take the freedoms here for granted and get training at the same time. Maybe? I don't know......at least I won't have to piss on all the punks that bother me for serving my country. :smokin:

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Offline Antigen

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Reinstating the Draft
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2004, 12:58:00 PM »
Quote
On 2004-10-08 10:20:00, thepatriot wrote:

They have already been doing that shit a long time, that is old news,


I think Kerry's people were a little behind. I've seen reference to this article all over the net. And yet Kerry was touting his support for No Child Left Behind.

I know this is nothing new, except that recruiters are apparently getting pretty tough with districts and schools who don't go along w/ their plan. But, otherwise, this is just another example of how, when you reach out to grab the money, that's when they slap the cuffs on you.  

I don't understand how the local schools can need federal funding when every household, w/ or w/o school age kids, pays a hefty school tax. And I don't understand why school administrators go along w/ conditional funding. Last I heard from the local guy, the Feds only provide about 6% of the budget, but they mandate over half of the spending.

To make certain that crime does not pay, the government should take it
over and try to run it

--G. Norman Collie

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Offline Deborah

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Reinstating the Draft
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2004, 04:36:00 PM »
***I don't understand how the local schools can need federal funding when every household, w/ or w/o school age kids, pays a hefty school tax. And I don't understand why school administrators go along w/ conditional funding. Last I heard from the local guy, the Feds only provide about 6% of the budget, but they mandate over half of the spending.

Remember how educators (as well as other 'profressionals') expect an annual cost of living raise, and medical/dental benefits, and a retirement account, etc, etc. Well every year the ditricts expenses increase so they have to have more income. They also spend thousands and thousand on these ridiculous TASP test and a bunch of other ridiculous and excessive bullshit. Poor management. We all know the actual cost of educating a child is far less than what we're paying. The whole system is based on excess and redundancy.

I think what we're seeing is the natural progression of a system that was flawed by design from the get go. At some point it is inevitiable that they would hit the ceiling of reality. You can't increase your expenses every year indefinitely. There is a limit to how much tax payers can pay. Tax payers can't pay for annual cost of living raises and all the perks, not to mention the gross mismanagement of the adequate funds they do have.

Further, educators need to stop their pathetic pity party. They are paid a living wage and have a lovely 2-3 month vacation every year. I don't know ONE teacher who is scraping by. I wouldn't support another pay raise for them until the majority of wage earners below them- who AREN'T making a living wage- get a raise. Last I checked, babysitters were earning $5-7 an hour. That seems fair for their contribution.
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Offline Deborah

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Reinstating the Draft
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2005, 01:37:00 PM »
How To Stay Out of the Military: A Primer On Draft Resistance
http://www.nodraftnoway.org/about.shtml
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2005, 01:03:00 PM »
Quote
On 2004-10-09 09:58:00, Antigen wrote:

"
Quote

On 2004-10-08 10:20:00, thepatriot wrote:


They have already been doing that shit a long time, that is old news,


<
I don't understand how the local schools can need federal funding when every household, w/ or w/o school age kids, pays a hefty school tax. And I don't understand why school administrators go along w/ conditional funding. Last I heard from the local guy, the Feds only provide about 6% of the budget, but they mandate over half of the spending.

To make certain that crime does not pay, the government should take it
over and try to run it

--G. Norman Collie

"



Good points.  If we actually stuck to the Constitution, the Federal Government would have nothing to do with Education:  10th Ammendment.  Government was never given authority to regulate education by the Founding Fathers.

School Administrators have to go along with it, otherwise, the government can come in and take over their school.  It has happened on rare occasion.  

Just because Bush said it, doesn't make it true.  Oh let me count the lies....
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2005, 03:39:00 AM »
Fuck it. draft all their asses or kick-em out! :smokin:
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2005, 05:24:00 AM »
Fuck it then, if they can't draft them, throw their asses in thought reform first. Then let them decide. Give them every option at the recruiters,and put them on the "drug exemption" programs. And take good care of them, and give them first choice at benefits.Let them choose their rating and give them high rating for volunteering. :smokin:
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