I personally escaped this Cult

[TC_Saved_Me]

I would say the vagueness is appropriately summarised by the entire corpus of theology.

I believed the moment I heard that Jesus died on a cross for my sins to be forgiven.  I also believed the moment I heard that Jesus loved me.  I just never understood why.  There wasn't a single sermon, or church service that gave me reason for any more understanding of my new found faith, so I see what your saying about the vagueness of theology.

I think it's a problem too.

I was a Christian for almost two years before I had enough discussions with others and studied the Bible enough to fully understand all the nuances of why I had become a Christian.

[none-ya]

T-C, as an American you have the right to believe any fool thing you want. You also had the right of free choise,as to stay or leave your program.Most of the people here did not have that choise. They were minors.If minors in your program are forced to ppadopt a religion or even made to read the Bible.(via court order),that is a clear violation of the separation of church and state. Believe what you want but don't force it upon children who don't know any better.

[TC_Saved_Me]

none-ya, that is completely irrelevant to the conversation that has taken place here.  You are talking about a completely different Teen Challenge.  Furthermore, we stopped talking about Teen Challenge over a week ago in this Discussion.

[Samara]

TC - I am happy you are happier and presumably, more ethical. But it all sounds batshit crazy to me.  No different than mythology.

And, really, I have a greater appreciation when people "do the right thing" without the hope or promise of reward. Intrinsic value.

[none-ya]

God save me from your followers!

[none-ya]

Religion is nothing more than fascism.Believe as I do or suffer the consequences

[none-ya]

T-C, Funny how you haven't responded To the woman who lost her son at the hands of teen challenge. Not even to offer condolences. How christian.

[Ursus]

T-C, Funny how you haven't responded To the woman who lost her son at the hands of teen challenge. Not even to offer condolences. How christian.

Here's a link to that thread, in case "TC_Saved_Me" is up for it:

• Young man died shortly after being kicked out of TC
  viewtopic.php?f=57&t=38009

[none-ya]

Man wrote the bible,but the facts speak for themselves.

[TC_Saved_Me]

And, really, I have a greater appreciation when people "do the right thing" without the hope or promise of reward. Intrinsic value.

So does the God of the Bible!  He tells us in the old testament that He desires mercy and not sacrifice.  He says that our good deeds are as "filthy rags" in His sight.  Christianity offers no promise of reward for doing the right thing - anyone who says that should study the Bible a little harder (alot of Christians consider the "rewards by doing good deeds" theology to be a terrible fallacy).  The only promise of reward that Christianity offers is eternal life through faith in Jesus Christ.

[none-ya]

BULL, The carrot on the end of the christian stick is heaven.
 And by the way I can't believe we had to shame you into responding to that woman who lost her son. It doesnt even sound like you read her story.

[TC_Saved_Me]

BULL, The carrot on the end of the christian stick is heaven.
 And by the way I can't believe we had to shame you into responding to that woman who lost her son. It doesnt even sound like you read her story.

You must have some serious gall to use that thread as an outlet for your bitterness!  That woman lost her son man!  

That thread is a fond tribute to that woman's son, and I think it was extremely distasteful for you to choose that thread to try to somehow challenge my beliefs.  

If you have a problem with me, fine!  If you have a problem with the rehab that God used to deliver me from an addiction that would have otherwise killed me, FINE!  Take it up with me!  

And if you think you can bate me into being a bad representation of Christ or Christianity, I have news for you... You probably can!  I've been a Christian for six years, and have a lot of growing up to do!  I'll be the first to admit that.  If you think I'm going to drop to your level of cynicalness, and pick a verbal fight on a thread that is honoring that woman's son, you do not know me very well.

Regarding your above comment, I'll have the last word!  You can rot away in your white washed tomb all you want.  I choose to stand before the presence of a Holy and Awesome God when I die!

"Blessed are those who are persecuted for My name's sake, for great is their reward in heaven." - Jesus Christ

[none-ya]

That's the nicest way I've ever been told to go to hell. jesus would be so proud of you.

[TC_Saved_Me]

I came here to present a different view of Teen Challenge that I didn't feel was being properly represented.  90% of the centers are for adults (ages 18 and over).  It is that majority that I wanted to offer some insight on.

It was fun how the conversation evolved into a theological discussion, and I always welcome freindly debate about religion.

I'll continue to poke my head in every now and again to see if anyone has any questions about the four Teen Challenge centers that I have first-hand experience with (Philadelphia, San Diego, Riverside, and Pittsburgh).

I'm certainly open for mature discussion about just about anything else as well.  I'll no longer respond to irrelevant castigations though.

[none-ya]

You offered up nothing useful here. You're just trying to do damage control for teen challenge. You say that they helped you, but you don't seem to care that they've killed others. I guess to you that's a fair trade off. I don't care about your religious beliefs I do however care about your attitude towards survivors and their families. Just because you have a plastic fish,and a WWJD? sticker on your car doesn't make you a good person. I'll bet you're the type who goes out to eat and leaves religious tracts on the table instead of a tip. Keep drinking the kool aid from your holy grail!